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http://www.mjjcommunity.com/forum/threads/129265-Katherine-Jackson-vs-AEG-Live-Daily-Trial-Testimony-Summary/page4Jacksons vs AEG - Day 53 – July 22 2013 – SummaryKatherine Jackson TestimonyAEG CrossPutnam explained to Mrs. Jackson about the discovery process, where both sides have to exchange documents related to the case. (ABC7)
Putnam asked two lines of questions _ about how she came to file the lawsuit and what documents she turned over in discovery. Putnam asked whether Katherine Jackson turned over emails or records of her son’s payments to her. She said no. Katherine Jackson’s attorney Brian Panish objected to the questions, but the judge allowed them. Panish said Mrs. Jackson doesn’t use email. Mrs. Jackson said her son paid for most of her expenses directly. He gave her cash, but she didn’t keep records of it. Putnam asked about Mrs. Jackson’s assistant, Janice Smith, questioning whether she logged payments from MJ. Answer was no. Katherine Jackson: “My son took care of me. He paid for everything. Food. Shelter. Clothing.” (AP)
Mrs. Jackson said MJ would give her money in cash, but she would not write down the amounts. The matriarch has a secretary, Janice Smith, who works for her for anywhere between 15-20 years. She has an office in Encino, CA (ABC7)
Putnam asking about the house in Gary, Indiana. It's been 44 years since she left and moved in to the Hayvenhurst house. Mrs. Jackson lives now in a gated community in Calabasas. Hayvenhurst house is under renovation. (ABC7)
At times her anger toward AEG attorney Marvin Putnam flared, and she refused to answer some questions. Putnam tried to parry with her at least once. She had a hard time recalling how long her assistant had worked for her but corrected Putnam over how long it had been since she had lived in Gary, Indiana. After a small portion of her deposition was shown to the jury, her temper erupted.“Why are you doing this to me?" she asked. "You’re asking me the same question 50 times, but you’re just rephrasing them." (LaTimes)
. "It was a gift," Mrs. Jackson said about the money she received from Michael. Putnam asked if she reported/recorded anywhere. "My son took care of me, food, shelter, clothes," Mrs. Jackson explained. "When he gave me cash, it was a gift, I didn't think I needed to report to anyone," Mrs. Jackson said. Putnam asked again if there was any record of the money MJ gave her. She replied she didn't think she needed to. (ABC7)
Putnam asked if Mrs. Jackson had a bank account back in 2010 when she filed her lawsuit. She said she doesn't recall. (ABC7)
Regarding Michael having money problems, Mrs. Jackson said : "My son made a lot of money, he had people working for him."
Putnam: Where you aware MJ was having financial difficulties when he passed away? Mrs. Jackson: Yes, I've heard from some people
"They have been saying it for 15 years," Mrs. Jackson said. "People were taking money from him also, stealing I should say."
Mrs. Jackson testified she heard stories about it. Putnam: Who did you hear that from? Mrs. Jackson: Just different people
She also said MJ told her too that people were making deals on his behalf.
"They were being offered money under the table, that's what I heard from my son," Mrs. Jackson testified. And Mrs. Jackson asked: "What does this have to do with the death of my son?"
Putnam: You heard about MJ having money problems? Mrs. Jackson: I heard for years Michael Jackson was broken and he wasn't
Putnam: Did you ever ask MJ about having money problems? Mrs. Jackson: No, because I didn't believe it. Because he wasn't. (ABC7)
Putnam also asked Katherine Jackson about her son's payments to her over the years. She said he directly paid many of the expenses on her home and would occasionally give her cash as a gift. Katherine Jackson said she didn't keep track of the payments and appeared to grow annoyed at the questions. "What does this have to do with the death of my son," she asked Putnam. (AP) Putnam asked Mrs. Jackson whether she was aware of her son’s financial difficulties before his death. She said yes. Katherine Jackson: "They’ve been saying for years, last 15 years that Michael Jackson is broke." She said she knew that wasn't true. (AP)
Putnam asked several more questions about what Katherine Jackson knew about her son Michael’s financial situation. There were objections. At one point, Mrs. Jackson told Puntam, “I think I answered that.” Judge allowed multiple questions about what she knew of MJ’s finances. Katherine Jackson said she was aware of people trying to make deals on her son’s behalf. She said her son would sometimes tell her about it. She said through the years, she heard about people taking money from her son. “Stealing, I should say.” Putnam again asked about the stories she’d heard. “I’d heard for years that Michael Jackson was broke, and he wasn’t,” she said. Katherine Jackson said she never discussed it with her son because she knew he wasn’t broke. (AP)
"I don't want to get into this," she said when asked about her superstar son's finances. The lawyer for AEG Live reminded Katherine that it was his job to ask questions because she wants a mountain of money for the claim AEG negligently hired Dr. Conrad Murray, the personal physican now serving four years for overdosing her son. (NYDailyNews)
Putnam asked about the damages Mrs. Jackson asked for in her lawsuit. MJ's mother responded that he could ask her attorneys about it. (ABC7) Putnam then asked Mrs. Jackson about the amount of damages she was seeking from AEG Live. “You can talk to my lawyer about that,” Katherine Jackson said of the damages estimates. Putnam cited figure of $1.5-$1.7 billion. Panish objected and said it was improper to ask Katherine Jackson about the estimates. The attorneys went into a sidebar with the judge. When they returned, Putnam asked about Mrs. Jackson whether she’d heard about various claims of damages. She said yes. (AP) Putnam asked if Mrs. Jackson has been here most of the days over the past 12 weeks. (ABC7)
That’s when Putnam asked Mrs. Jackson whether she thought her son bore any responsibility for his death. “No, I don’t,” she replied. Putnam asked Mrs. Jackson if she agreed that she never believed her son was responsible for his death. “Correct,” she replied. (AP)
Putnam: Do you believe that your son is in any way responsible for his passing? Mrs. Jackson: No I don't
Putnam: You never believed your son had any part in his own death? Mrs. Jackson: Correct!
Putnam: Do you believe your son MJ knew Dr. Murray was giving him Propofol? Panish: Objection, calls for speculation
Putnam: Do you remember MJ asking for Propofol? Panish: Calls for hearsay response
Putnam: Did you hear from the criminal trial that your son asked Dr. Murray to give him Propofol? Mrs. Jackson: I have heard
Mrs. Jackson said she had not heard that MJ asked other doctors for Propofol. Putnam asked if that came to a surprise for her. She said yes. "Conrad Murray, even if he asked, he could've said no," Mrs. Jackson opined. (ABC7) Katherine Jackson said she believes AEG Live hired Murray, not her son. She said she never heard of the cardiologist until her son died, and indicated that she felt Murray bore responsibility for her son's death."Even though he asked for it, he could have said no," Katherine Jackson said of Murray. (AP)
Putnam asked about Murray’s criminal case, and whether Mrs. Jackson helped the prosecutor, David Walgren. She said she didn’t remember. (AP) When questioned by AEG lead counsel Marvin Putnam, she "did not remember" if she attended Murray's manslaughter trial and assisted the prosecution in that case. (NBC)
The lawyer asked about what Mrs. Jackson recalled hearing during the criminal trial about her son’s use of propofol. She said she remembered hearing about him asking for the drug, but she didn’t recall testimony about him discussing it with other doctors. Katherine Jackson had her head down during some of the questions. “Even though he asked for it, he could have said no,” she said of Murray. (AP)
Putnam: Do you believe your son hired Dr. Murray? Mrs. Jackson: No I don't
Putnam: You heard testimony MJ hired Dr. Murray in Las Vegas? Mrs Jackson: He had doctors for his children, I don't know if it was Dr Murray
Putnam asked if MJ ever paid Dr. Murray. She answered it was to treat the children.
Putnam asked if she heard testimony from Prince saying he would give Dr. Murray stacks of money in a rubber band.
"He didn't say stacks, he measure with his fingers," Mrs. Jackson explained.
Mrs. Jackson said she doesn't believe that MJ hired Dr. Murray because of what she's been listening here in court. She said from hearing the emails, AEG said they had hired him and that Randy Phillips went on TV saying they hired him.
Mrs. Jackson: I had heard they had hired and there was the doctor there so I thought MJ had hired him, not knowing the facts. (ABC7)
Putnam asked how she remembers it when she said her memory wasn't very good. "I didn't say I didn't remember anything, I said I'm 83, I would 't remember everything," Mrs. Jackson responded. Mrs Jackson said that's all that's been talked about in the trial and that she remembers emails, Phillips' interview saying AEG hired Murray (ABC7) Despite the fact that she is “83-year-old and may not remember everything clearly,” Katherine testified that she distinctly remembers that AEG hired Murray--not her son. (NBC) Katherine also said she did not know that her son used Propofol and that he gave Murray money "because he felt bad for [him] because he didn't have no money--not because he had hired him." She had no idea the doctor spent six nights a week at her son's home. (NBC)
Putnam then asked Mrs. Jackson whether she believed her son hired Conrad Murray. She said she didn’t think he hired the doctor. She said she knew her son had doctors for his children. She said she didn’t know if that was Murray or not. Putnam asked about Prince Jackson’s testimony that he’d given Murray money that his father handed him. Putnam called it “stacks of hundreds” Katherine Jackson corrected him, saying it wasn’t stacks. She said the money was because her son felt bad for the doctor. Putnam asked Mrs. Jackson whether she knew about the payments to Murray before the trial. She said no. Putnam then asked her about an instance in which Mrs. Jackson said she thought her son Michael hired Conrad Murray. Katherine Jackson: “I may have said it once and you’ll probably bring that up.” (Her statement was during a Dateline interview.) Putnam wants to play the Dateline interview, but Panish objected, saying he hadn’t seen it. Judge told Putnam to hold off on playing the Dateline interview for the jury until it could be reviewed. Katherine Jackson said he now understood that AEG Live had hired Murray, but she hadn’t heard that before. “At the time I hadn’t heard it,” Katherine Jackson said. “I thought that maybe Michael had hired him. I said it not knowing the facts.” Putnam indicated the Dateline interview was done 8 weeks before Katherine Jackson filed her lawsuit in September 2010. (AP)
Putnam: Do you recall why you said your son hired the doctor and that your son could've prevented his own death?
"I don't think he could've prevented his own death," Mrs. Jackson testified. "I just said I thought he hired the doctor. I do recall that."
Mrs. Jackson said she can't recall exactly what was said in the Dateline interview, but she does remember saying MJ hired the doctor. (ABC7)
Mrs. Jackson said she had not heard about Dr. Murray prior to MJ's death. Her son did not discuss what treatments he was having with her.
Putnam: Prior to your son's death, did you know your son had a doctor spending the night at the house? Mrs. Jackson: No
Putnam: Did you ever have conversation with your grandchildren prior to trial about the doctor spending the night at the house? She said no
Putnam asked if Prince testified a doctor was spending the nights at the house. Mrs. Jackson: I don't remember him saying that
Putnam: Do you remember him (Prince) saying he (the doctor) spent 6 nights a week? Mrs. Jackson: No, I don't remember that (ABC7)
Putnam also grilled Katherine on the timing of her lawsuit, which was filed a year before Murray's 2011 criminal trial. "Prior to the trial...did you ever talk to your grandchildren about the fact that Dr. Murray treated Michael Jackson upstairs in a bedroom behind locked doors," Putnam asked. "No," she replied. "Mrs. Jackson, you do believe that Dr. Conrad Murray has some responsibility for your son's death, do you not?" he asked. "Of course," she said. (NYDailyNews)
Putnam asked Mrs. Jackson whether she knew that Conrad Murray was staying at her son’s mansion 6 nights a week in 2009. She said she didn’t know anything about her son’s doctors. Putnam asked if she discussed with her grandchildren, and she said no. Katherine Jackson’s brow was furrowed through this questioning. Panish objected, saying Putnam was trying to get into attorney-client issues. Putnam was allowed to question her about her knowledge of Murray’s doctor visits, as long as Mrs. Jackson didn’t relay any info that she received from conversations with her attorneys. (AP)
Putnam asked Mrs. Jackson's search for the truth and if she thought it would be important to know whether the doctor spending the nights. "It would've been important but I told you I didn't talk to my grandchildren about that," Mrs. Jackson responded. Putnam asked if Mrs. Jackson talked to her grandchildren about Dr. Murray treating MJ in a locked, upstairs bedroom. She answered no. (ABC7)
Putnam: You do believe Dr. Murray has some responsibility for your son's death? Mrs. Jackson: Of course
Putnam asked Mrs. Jackson if Dr. Murray was convicted in the criminal trial. She said yes.
He asked if the doctor is now in jail. "I hope he is," she responded. (ABC7)
Putnam inquired about Mrs. Jackson asking the District Attorney to drop the $100 million restitution against Dr. Murray. Mrs. Jackson said yes, that Dr. Murray has children and has no money. "Because I felt his children needed him to take care of them," she explained. "He didn't have any money."
Putnam: You asked the DA to drop the $100 million restitution claim against Dr. Murray?
Mrs. Jackson: I asked them to drop it because of his children, he has quite a few children, 7 or 8, I don't know.
Mrs. Jackson said she believes the DA may have dropped the $100 million restitution claim.
Putnam: Did you drop the restitution claim so you could file this lawsuit? Mrs. Jackson: No (ABC7)
She said she asked prosecutors to drop a $100 million restitution claim against Murray because he has several children. "His money should go to the children," she said. (AP) Going back to updates from the morning session. Putnam asked Mrs. Jackson about dropping the $100 million restitution claim against Murray. Mrs. Jackson said, “I felt that his children needed it.” She mentioned she knew Murray had 7 or 8 children. Putnam questioned whether the decision was made in consideration of the civil case. Mrs. Jackson said no. “I never gave it a thought.” (AP)
The lawyer then asked whether Mrs. Jackson ever saw her son when she thought he was under the influence of any drug. She said no. (AP) Putnam asked if Mrs. Jackson ever saw MJ under the influence of any drug. She said no, that it's something she never saw during his lifetime.She would show up at the house unannounced and said she never saw her son "loopy".
Putnam: Did you ever speak with your son on the phone when he was out of it? Mrs. Jackson: No. Out of what?
Putnam asked if Mrs. Jackson's children told her MJ was under the influence of something. She said yes.
"A couple of children came to me and told me they had heard about it," Mrs. Jackson said. She had conversation w/ MJ about it in Las Vegas. (ABC7)
She provoked laughter when answering a question about whether her son had ever seemed "out of it" when she spoke to him on the phone. "Out of what?" she said, before Putnam explained the meaning of the phrase. (AFP)
Putnam asked Mrs. Jackson is she remembers her son's criminal trial in 2005. She said yes, and that she attended the trial every day. Putnam inquired if MJ left the country after the trial. She said yes. When MJ came back he lived in Las Vegas never lived in Neverland again. Mrs. Jackson spoke with Michael about what she heard of him using prescription drugs. "I've heard that something had happened to him," Mrs. Jackson described. (ABC7)
Putnam: When you said that, he denied it, right? Mrs. Jackson: Yes he did"I was his mother, I imagined he'd deny it," Mrs. Jackson explained. "No child is going to admit it, if I heard something bad about them." Mrs. Jackson said she didn't know MJ was taking pain pills, she couldn't prove it, that's what she had heard. Mrs. Jackson: It didn't surprise me, I'm the mother, he would not want his mother to worry about him. Putnam: If you knew your son was going to deny it, why did you ask him? Mrs. Jackson: I'm not answering that question. Because to me it doesn't make sense. I didn't know he was going to deny it. "It's because he didn't want me to worry," Mrs. Jackson said. "I just talked to him about it." Mrs. Jackson to Putnam: I don't think it's that serious that you have to drill it like that on me. Mrs. Jackson: My child, he respected his mother he didn't want to hurt if it was bad.Putnam: He wasn't a child but 50 years old? Mrs Jackson: He was still my child, I'm still his mother and he wants to hold his respect for me.Mrs. Jackson: You're just trying to confuse me so that you can come back with something. Mrs. Jackson: You do understand (the answer) and you keep asking the same question. (ABC7)
Putnam continued to ask a series of questions about Jackson’s prescription drug use and his denials. Putnam: “If you knew your son was going to deny it, why did you ask him?”
Mrs. Jackson: “I’m not answering that question.”
Putnam: “Why?”
“To me, it doesn’t make sense,” Katherine Jackson said. “I didn’t know he was going to deny it. But he did it.”
After a few more questions, Mrs. Jackson told Putnam she didn’t have to either “drill me” or “grill me” like this. She likened her son’s denial to a young child who went out and disobeyed his mother and then denied it. “I’m sure you understand,” she said. “He respects his mother, he don’t want her to think that he’s doing something that bad,” Mrs. Jackson said. “He’s still my child,” she replied. She added, “He’d still want me to hold his respect.” (AP)
There were more questions about Michael Jackson’s prescription drug use. Putnam said he was trying to understand the testimony. “You keep asking the same questions and I’ve answered it,” Mrs. Jackson said. Putnam asked if there was ever a time she believed her son was abusing prescription meds. “No,” she said. “I knew he was taking it. I didn’t think he was abusing it,” Katherine Jackson said about her son Michael's prescription drug use. (AP)
The attorney also asked about Katherine Jackson about conversations she had with her son about prescription drug use. She said she asked him about it when he lived in Las Vegas and he denied he was abusing prescription medications. "I'm a mother, quite naturally he denied it," she said. "He wouldn't want me to think that." She said she was aware her son took medications for pain in his back and scalp after he sustained injuries over his career. She said she never saw signs that her son was abusing medications, including when she and several of her children went to the singer's Neverland Ranch for an intervention. Her son was fine but upset that they thought he had a problem.(AP) He also quizzed her at length about a family "intervention" in 2002, when she and various children including Janet and Rebbie went to confront Jackson about his reported drug problems at his Neverland ranch. But the confrontation came to nothing, she said, after the singer appeared upset when he realized why they were there. "We just saw that he was okay and he was upset, so we didn't talk about it," she said. (AFP)
Katherine also recalled joining her daughter Janet and other relatives for a surprise intervention at Neverland Ranch in 2002. She said Michael was upset by the intrusion and appeared to be sober. "There were no deep discussion or anything like that. When we got there, he was okay, he was upset," she recalled. "It was kind of embarassing." (NYDailyNews)
Asked about reports that she and her other children had staged an intervention effort at Michael’s Neverland Ranch in Santa Barbara County in 2002, Katherine Jackson testified that her son didn't know why his family had driven there and made it sound as if the visit had turned into a social gathering.“We just saw he was OK and was upset, and ... there was no deep discussion or anything," she said under questioning.She said that neither she nor her other children questioned the singer about his use of prescription medication. (LAtimes)
Mrs. Jackson was asked about the 2002 intervention attempt at Neverland Ranch. Mrs. Jackson said her son was fine. “When we got there, there was nothing wrong with him,” Mrs. Jackson said. She said he was upset that his family came for an intervention, but there wasn't any “deep discussion” about it. Putnam asked about Katherine Jackson’s deposition, when she recalled her son saying, “’I’m not on it.’” Today, Katherine Jackson said she didn’t recall whether he said that phrase or not. “I wasn’t trying to lie,” she said. “I was just tired of you,” Katherine Jackson said of Putnam. Mrs. Jackson said she recalled Putnam “asking me the same question about 50 times and rephrasing them differently.” (AP)
Testifying for the second day in her family's wrongful-death suit against entertainment giant AEG Live, the family matriarch said the conversation occurred as she was getting ready to leave her son's house in Las Vegas, where Michael Jackson lived from 2006 to 2008. She said she told Michael that she had heard he was using prescription drugs and that she didn't want him to end up "like all the others." On the stand Monday, Katherine Jackson said she knew her son was using prescription pain pills for burns he suffered to his scalp during the filming of a Pepsi commercial and for a back injury and said that she figured he would deny any drug abuse because he didn't want her to worry. "If a child goes out to play and does something real ugly, and a parent asks them about it, he’s gong to deny it,” she said.
“If you knew your son was gong to deny it, why did you ask him?” Putnam asked. “I’m not answering that question ... because to me it doesn’t make sense," Jackson said."I didn't know he was gong to deny it, but he did.” (LAtimes)
Katherine Jackson said he denied abusing pain pills during their one and only private conversation on the topic in Las Vegas. The famous music matriarch lost her cool when a lawyer for the concert promoter she's suing for more than $1 billion asked her repeatedly about the date and details of the mother-son meeting in Vegas. "I'm not answering that question," she shot back at one query she felt "didn't make sense." She then accused the lawyer of intentionally trying to trap over the exact wording of the confrontation. "You're just getting me confused so you'll have something to come back on," the 83-year-old said sternly. (NYDailyNews)
Mrs. Jackson mentioned that her other children told her they believed Michael Jackson had a problem with prescription meds. Putnam then asked about Mrs. Jackson’s conversation with her son in Las Vegas regarding his prescription drug use. Katherine Jackson said she and her son stepped into a theater at the home that was near the front door and talked about it. She said she asked him about his prescription medication use. Mrs. Jackson said her son denied he had a problem. Katherine Jackson: “I’m a mother, quite naturally he denied it. He wouldn't want me to think that.” (AP)
Putnam: Has there ever been a time you believe your son was abusing prescription drugs? Mrs. Jackson: No
"I believe he was taking it, but I don't believe he was abusing it" Mrs Jackson said. "I just asked him the question, I wanted to make sure". Even tough Mrs. Jackson didn't believe MJ was abusing prescription drugs she was part of an intervention at Neverland. She doesn't remember all the siblings present, but probably Janet, Rebbie and Randy were there. She said there was a person who came along that Janet brought specialized in intervention. Putnam: Do you recall this taking place in 2002? Mrs. Jackson: Yes Mrs. Jackson said she doesn't believe MJ knew why they were there. Putnam asked if MJ was mad they came for an intervention. Mrs. Jackson: Yes, because when we got there, there was nothing wrong with him"We asked if he was okay, he got upset and we didn't talk about it," Mrs. Jackson explained. "He didn't deny anything, he was ok," Mrs. Jackson said. There was no deep discussion, we got there and he was ok, he was upset." Mrs. Jackson: It was kind of embarrassing, because they didn't see anything. Putnam asked if Mrs. Jackson saw him upset. "If I said he was upset, I did see it," she responded. Putnam: After he got upset, did he say to you "I'm not on it, I'm not on anything?" Mrs. Jackson: He didn't say that.Putnam played part of Mrs. Jackson's deposition where she said she knew MJ was upset, by the way he talked, said "I'm not on it," that's all.Putnam asked if at the intervention MJ denied he was on influence of prescription drugs? Mrs. Jackson: To tell you the truth, I don't know.Mrs. Jackson said she was upset with Putnam during deposition. "I was just tired of you asking the same question 50 times in different ways".Putnam: Do you remember in your deposition you didn't know whether to believe your son at all?. "I knew he was on prescription drugs, but he was not abusing it," Mrs. Jackson said. After intervention at Neverland in 2002 Putnam asked if her mind changed about MJ abusing drugs. She said she didn't know one way or another (ABC7)
Katherine said that she never saw her son under the influence of drugs and never saw him “loopy, or out of it," even on the telephone. But, after her other children told her they believed he was addicted to prescription drugs and Michael denied it to her, she participated in an intervention at the Neverland ranch in 2002. “I knew he was taking them (pain pills) but I didn’t know he was abusing them,” Katherine told the jury. She said Michael was upset when the family staged the intervention "because when we got there, there was nothing wrong with him.” The intervention, she added, didn't really take place because he was upset and yelled at them and she became embarrassed to be there, she testified. (NBC)
Putnam showed a letter on People Magazine (Sept. 7, 2007) the family sent about MJ not addicted to pain killers and alcohol. Mrs. Jackson: We were not trying to take away the business or anything like that. That's a lie. Mrs. Jackson said she never attempted to take her son's business. Just because it's in the magazine tabloids doesn't make it true, she said."There are lies, these are all lies," Mrs. Jackson said. "We didn't try to take his business away." Tito, Marlon, Jackie, Jermaine, Katherine signed this letter. Putnam asked why she signed it if it wasn't true, she said I wanted it to stop.Mrs. Jackson: As far as the tabloids, I didn't waste my time because I know all they do is to try to make money
Putnam: Isn't it true your son MJ asked you to sign this? Mrs. Jackson: I don't remember my son asking me to sign this
Mrs. Jackson said she doesn't' remember MJ being involved in the draft of the letter. She doesn't know who asked her to sign it.
Putnam showed Mrs. Jackson Randy's deposition saying MJ asked her to sign the letter. She said it doesn't refresh her recollection about it. (ABC7)
She then was asked about an open letter to the media that she signed in 2007 along with several of Michael's siblings. It denied Michael had a drug problem and any history of a family intervention. "Why would you sign it if it wasn't true?" Putnam asked. "I wanted (to stop) things that weren't true," she said, appearing confused. (NYDailyNews)
Putnam asked Mrs. Jackson several questions about a letter she and other Jackson family members signed regarding an intervention. The letter was regarding reports about her son’s prescription drug use. I believe it was from 2007. Putnam at one point brought up Randy Jackson’s deposition and asked Mrs. Jackson if she had read any of her children’s depos. She said no. Putnam was able to show Mrs. Jackson her son Randy’s deposition after saying he would call him as a witness later. Depo wasn’t shown to jury (AP)
AEG's lawyer showed Katherine an open letter to the media she signed and released in 2007 denying there was ever a family intervention and also denying that Michael Jackson was addicted to drugs and alcohol. The lawyer also played a 2010 Oprah interview in which Katherine admitted that Michael was an addict. (AP)
Putnam asked Mrs. Jackson if she was aware of her son’s statement at the end of the “Dangerous” tour indicating a prescription drug problem. She said she hadn’t heard about it or seen it before it was played in court. She said she didn’t watch much television. Putnam: “Mrs. Jackson on Friday, you mentioned that you shut your ears to bad things. Do you remember saying that?” “I probably said it, but I don’t remember saying it,” Mrs. Jackson said, adding, “I don’t like to hear bad news.” Putnam asked if Mrs. Jackson shut out hearing bad news about her son ending the Dangerous tour. She said she didn't remember how it ended. (AP)
Putnam: Were you aware your son MJ had gone to rehab before?
Mrs. Jackson: I had heard that, that Elizabeth Taylor had something to do about drugs but I don't watch television that much.
Mrs. Jackson: My children probably didn't want me to know about it.
Mrs. Jackson said she did not discuss with MJ about it and had never heard MJ's 1993 announcement he was going into rehab. MJ's mother said she never heard before tour had been canceled because of MJ's rehab. She said it doesn't mean it wasn't but she didn't know (ABC7)
On Monday, she seemed unfamiliar with some of the details of Michael’s life. She told the court she didn’t know her son's "Dangerous" tour had come to an early ending in 1993 when Elizabeth Taylor flew to Mexico City to take the singer to a rehab program in London.
Katherine Jackson testified that she’d she heard that Taylor had said something about her son going into rehab but didn't seem particularly curious about it.“Nobody came to me and said anything about it," she said. "My children probably didn’t want me to worry.”She said she didn't know that her son’s worldwide tour had been cut short. "I don't like to hear bad news," she said. (LATimes)
Putnam asked about whether she shut her ears to bad things. "I may have said that but I don't remember," Mrs. Jackson responded. Mrs. Jackson: I don't like hearing bad news. (ABC7)
Putnam asked about the attempted intervention in 2002. He asked about Dr. Farshchian treating MJ's addiction to Demerol. Mrs. Jackson said he doesn't recall Dr. Farshchian and does not recall any phone call with any doctor about MJ's addiction to Demerol. Putnam showed Mrs. Jackson transcript of Dr. Farshchian's deposition and asked if that refreshed her recollection. She said it doesn't. Putnam asked if Dr. Farshchian testified he spoke with her because she wanted to know all the details of her son's Demerol use. "I don't remember who Dr. Farshchian is and I don't remember treating Michael for Demerol," Mrs. Jackson said.
Putnam: Do you remember testimony about MJ having an implant to treat Demerol? Mrs. Jackson: I don't know anything about that
Mrs. Jackson said she doesn't remember discussing the implant in 2002. Mrs. Jackson said she does not remember MJ showing her a Narcan patch. (ABC7)
After the lunch break, Putnam asked about an implant that Michael Jackson apparently had to keep any addiction to Demerol in check. Putnam asked Mrs. Jackson if she ever saw the implant or talked to the doctor who put it in her son. Mrs. Jackson said she didn’t remember. Katherine Jackson said she didn't recall the doctor and didn't remember seeing the implant. She said she would have remembered seeing it. (AP)
As to Louis Farrakhan -- she met him, but doesn't remember seeing him at Neverland. (ABC7)
Putnam asked if Mrs Jackson knows there were a number of doctors who testified in this case. She said she didn't know, didn't see deposition (ABC7)
Putnam asked Mrs. Jackson about a Nov. 2010 interview with Oprah Winfrey. After a few questions, Putnam played the clip. In the clip, she said she was aware her son was taking prescription meds after his Pepsi commercial accident, but it was a long time before she heard he was addicted to them. She also discussed an intervention attempt by her children. Oprah asked Mrs. Jackson about her conversation with her son and asked if she believed his denials. She told Oprah she didn't believe him. In court, Katherine Jackson clarified. “I kind of believed him and I didn't believe him. I didn't know what to believe,” she said. (AP)
Putnam asked if she recalls sitting down for interview with Oprah Winfrey in the fall of 2010. Mrs. Jackson said yes.Oprah's interview aired about a month after the the lawsuit was filed. She watched it when it aired at the Hayvenhurst house. Putnam: Did you try to tell the truth in that interview? Mrs. Jackson: YesPutnam: You said you believed your son was addicted to drugs? Mrs. Jackson: I told Oprah that.Mrs. Jackson: I told you MJ was on painkillers, but I don't think he was abusing it.In Oprah's interview, Mrs. Jackson said it was a long time before she knew MJ was addicted to painkillers. She also said about the family's attempted intervention: the children told her to take MJ to rehab and kind of clean him up. Mrs. Jackson told Oprah she didn't want to hear MJ had overdosed. MJ kept saying he wasn't on it, and that his own mother didn't believe him.Mrs. Jackson: I kind of believe it and didn't believe it, hearing from my children, hearing from other people. "I didn't know what to believe," Mrs. Jackson said. Mrs. Jackson conceded she denied this morning that her son was abusing drugs. (ABC7)
Putnam: Do you think your son was abusing painkillers? Mrs. Jackson: I don't know. "I didn't know what to believe," she said. "I went to Neverland because my children kept asking me and I was concerned." Putnam: Was there a time you were concerned with MJ using painkillers? Mrs. Jackson: I can't say I weren't concerned.Putnam: Was there any time during the criminal trial that you were concerned MJ was under the influence of something? Mrs. Jackson: No (ABC7) Putnam asked whether during her son’s criminal trial whether she ever thought her son was on medications. She said no. (AP)
Katherine Jackson said she never discussed any concerns about her son's medication use with his lawyers or managers. Katherine Jackson said she occasionally talked to Jackson’s managers, including Frank Dileo. She wasn’t thrilled when Dileo came back. “They keep hiring all these people that Michael had fired. That’s what bothered me,” Katherine Jackson said. Putnam asked about the letter her son signed regarding Dileo. She said he told her he was only back in her son’s life for the tour. (AP) Mrs. Jackson said she never discussed with her son's attorneys or managers about her concerns.Mrs. Jackson said she had many conversations with Frank DiLeo and they were all friendly.She remembers answering the phone when Frank DiLeo went back to work for Michael. Mrs. Jackson wanted to know why people kept re-hiring people Michael had fired. Putnam asked if it was someone other than MJ who hired DiLeo. "I think so, Michael didn't want him back," she said. Mrs. Jackson: Michael and DiLeo told me he was back for the This Is It tour. (ABC7)
Katherine Jackson said she never relayed any concerns about her son’s prescription drug use to anyone at AEG Live. (AP)
Putnam: Did you tell Mr. DiLeo you were concerned that your son was abusing painkillers? Mrs. Jackson: No, since he had just come back
Mrs. Jackson said she never told AEG Live or Randy Phillips about MJ having drug problem. (ABC7)
Mrs. Jackson testified she was receiving money from MJ and also from Janet Jackson. At first, it was not on a monthly basis, but it became that way, Mrs. Jackson explained. Janet sent her $10,000 a month. Mrs. Jackson said she was receiving that amount when MJ died. The money went to her assistant Janice at the office. Mrs. Jackson said she told Janet she didn't have to continue to send her money after MJ died. (ABC7)
Putnam then asked about financial support Janet Jackson was providing her mom. She was giving $10k a month to support her mother. This money was coming in for several years before Michael Jackson’s death, but Mrs. Jackson said she eventually told her daughter to stop. (AP)
Jackson redirectPutnam ended his questioning, and Panish took over. He asked about Michael’s support. Mrs. Jackson said he was paying for her necessities. (AP)
In re-direct, Panish asked if before MJ died, was he paying for everything? Mrs. Jackson: Yes, paying for everything
Panish: Did you rely on him (MJ) for all necessities of life? Mrs. Jackson: Yes (ABC7)
Panish inquired if Putnam asked during deposition personal question? Mrs. Jackson: Yes, he asked 'did your husband beat you'? (ABC7)
Panish: Farrakhan and Nation of Islam, does that have anything to do with your son's death? Mrs. Jackson: No P: Were you upset? Mrs. J: Yes (ABC7)
Panish asked whether Mrs. Jackson used email or a computer. She said she was computer illiterate. He also asked Katherine Jackson if she was a lawyer or a private investigator. The answers were no, obviously. The lawyer asked who she hired to find out the truth about her son’s death. Mrs. Jackson said she hired Panish’s firm. (AP)
Mrs Jackson said she doesn't know anything about computers, it's not a lawyer or investigator. Her highest level of education is high school. Panish asked what she did to go about this case. "I hired your firm," Mrs. Jackson said. "Why," Panish asked. "I wanted to find out what really happened to my son," Mrs. Jackson responded. (ABC7)
Phillips and Gongaware never called/send card to Mrs. Jackson after MJ died, Mrs Jackson said. Kenny Ortega went to see her, she said. (ABC7)
Panish asked about testimony that AEG Live execs Randy Phillips and Paul Gongaware loved her son. She said they never called her to express their condolences. They never sent a card. Mrs. Jackson said Kenny Ortega did come to see her after her son’s death. (AP)
He asked her about emails that had been displayed in court, ones Panish said she never would have seen if not for the lawsuit. In response several of Panish’s questions, she said she didn't know her son was losing weight or tour workers thought he was deteriorating. “I learned it here in court,” Mrs. Jackson said of the emails, other details about her son’s health. (AP)
Panish: Did you know your son was sleep-deprived for 60 days? Mrs. Jackson: No, I didn't
Panish asked if she knew Hougdahl wrote an email to AEG that MJ was deteriorating in front of his eyes? Mrs. Jackson: No
Mrs. Jackson said she learned about MJ's condition in court, that AEG never told her MJ was deteriorating, paranoia, losing weight, rambling. "The could've called me, he was asking for his father, he was scared, he was asking for Joseph," Mrs. Jackson said, crying. (ABC7)
“They could have called me,” Mrs. Jackson said. “He was asking me for his father. My grandson told me that his daddy was nervous and scared” (AP) Clutching a tissue and hanging her head at times, Katherine Jackson said she didn't know the extent of her son's weakness until after the start of her trial against AEG Live LLC. "They watched him waste away," she said after her attorney cited several emails from top workers preparing for the "This Is It" shows. The messages described her son's condition as deteriorating and cited his inability to rehearse. "They could have called me," Katherine Jackson, 83, said. "He was asking me for his father. My grandson told me that his daddy was nervous and scared." (AP) She said if the family had known, Joe Jackson would have stepped in. “They watched him waste away,” she said of AEG’s execs. (AP)
After Panish asked about an email in which an AEG corporate lawyer called her son a freak, Mrs. Jackson was crying. (AP)
Panish: Did AEG ever tell you they called your son a freak? Mrs. Jackson: No P: And that it was creepy meeting your son? Mrs. J: No (crying).Mrs. Jackson: They were there, without calling somebody. My husband and I would have been there in a second (crying)."They watched him waste away and waited, I know they did it," Mrs. Jackson said, crying. Panish showed picture of MJ in June 09 and asked if she ever saw her son like that. "Never," said Mrs. Jackson crying, wiping her eyes. (ABC7) She also said that she didn't see a photograph of her son shot six days before her his death until after the trial started. Katherine Jackson at first didn't seem to want to look at the photo, which has been repeatedly displayed during the trial and shows her son wearing a T-shirt, his arms thin and bones visible in his upper chest. (AP) Panish showed Mrs. Jackson the picture of her son taken on June 19th in which he looks extremely thin. She looked away at first. Panish asked if she’d ever seen her son look like that. “Never,” Katherine Jackson replied. (She’d never seen the photo before the trial.) (AP)
Mrs. Jackson was asked about the $100 million restitution figure. She said she didn't set the amount, but told the DA not to pursue it. (AP) Panish: Issue of restitution was the state decision and you told them not to do it, correct? Mrs. Jackson: Yes. Panish asked if the figure for restitution was set by the state. Mrs. Jackson said yes. (ABC7)
AEG recrossPutnam then took over questioning again. He showed the clip from the Dateline show that was discussed before lunch. (AP) In re-cross, Putnam showed a video where Mrs. Jackson said "It could've been prevented, he hired a doctor to take care of him." (ABC7)
Putnam asked if Mrs. Jackson talked to her grandchildren about Dr. Murray in search of the truth."I could, but I didn't want to bring that up with them," Mrs. Jackson answered. Putnam asked if Mrs. Jackson spoke with Sister Rose, the kids' nanny. "She told me that MJ was very weak, and she told me that she talked about what went down at the practice, they had to hold him up" she said. Mrs. Jackson doesn't know why Sister Rose is called sister and Brother Michael is brother. (ABC7)
an attorney for AEG Live had questioned why the Jackson family matriarch —if her purpose for filing the lawsuit was to find out the truth about her son's death, as she had testified — hadn't read through thousands of pages of deposition testimony, or asked her grandchildren about what happened in her son's rented mansion before his June 2009 death. She later said that while she could have asked her grandchildren about some issues, she didn't want to bring it up with them. (AP)
Putnam: Did I say anything improper in the deposition regarding the Nation of Islam? Mrs. Jackson: You were asking me question about it (ABC7)
He then asked Mrs. Jackson if she had ever met Paul Gongaware. She said she hadn't. “No, but that shouldn’t have stopped him from saying, ‘I’m sorry for what happened to your son,’” she said. (AP) Putnam asked if Mrs. Jackson knows Gongaware. "No, but that shouldn't have stopped him, to say I'm sorry what happened to your son" she said (ABC7)
Putnam asked if AEG put together a Memorial Service for MJ. She said yes. Mrs. Jackson said AEG told her if she did the memorial service at the Staples Center it would be free (she wanted to do it at the Coliseum) (ABC7) Putnam asked about the Staples Center memorial service. Mrs. Jackson said she wanted to hold it at the LA Coliseum, which is much bigger. She said she was told that if it was held at the Staples Center, the family wouldn't have to pay for it. (AP)
Jackson redirectPanish took over again and asked Mrs. Jackson whether she received condolence cards from strangers. She said she got 1000s of them. (AP) In re-re-direct, Panish asked: They still didn't send a card, did they? Mrs. Jackson: No. Thousands and thousands of people sent her card. (ABC7)
She's a Jehovah's Witness and there's a difference between her religion and the Nation of Islam. (ABC7)
Regarding the interview, Mrs. Jackson said she just assumed, she didn't know whether MJ had hired Dr. Murray. (ABC7) Panish played the clip of Randy Phillips in which he was interviewed by Sky News a few days after Michael Jackson’s death. Phillips said in the interview that that Dr. Murray was hired by AEG at the request of Michael Jackson. (AP) Panish showed video of Phillips saying they hired him. Panish: Did Sister Rose discuss with you about AEG pressuring MJ? Mrs. Jackson: Yes (ABC7)
Panish: There was a suggestion in this trial you hired Kai Chase back so she can testify in your favor? Mrs. Jackson: Kai Chase has been working for me not quite a year yet Panish: Did you hire Kai Chase so she would testify in your favor? Mrs. Jackson: No, not at all. The children knew her, they wanted her, that's why. (ABC7)
AEG recrossPutnam asked about why Katherine Jackson didn’t bring up what happened in the Carrolwood house with her grandchildren. Mrs. Jackson said she could have asked them, but didn’t bring it up with them. She also said she didn’t discuss it with Kai Chase. (AP)
In re-re-cross, Putnam inquired Phillips said 'we hired him' and Mrs. Jackson said 'Michael' hired him. Mrs. Jackson: Like I said, I didn't know who hired him at that time. Putnam said one of them was not right in their interview. Mrs. Jackson answered: "I'm not correct." (ABC7) Putnam said based on the clips showed in the Dateline interview and Phillips’ Sky News interview, someone was wrong about who hired Murray. Katherine Jackson said she was wrong in her interview, that she assumed her son had hired Conrad Murray. (AP)
Jackson redirectPanish came back up one more time and asked whether Katherine Jackson expected the CEO of AEG Live to know who hired Murray. (AP) In re-re-re-direct, Panish asked: Who do you think it's in a better position to know who hired the doctor, you or the CEO of AEG? Mrs. Jackson: The CEO of AEG (ABC7)
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Judge told jury we are now moving to defendants' case, even though plaintiffs have not yet rested their case in chief.
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John Meglen (AEG Witness) TestimonyAEG directAEG's attorney Jessica Stebbins Bina did direct examination.
John Meglen is a concert promoter, works at AEG Live, he's the president and CEO of Concerts West. Paul Gongaware is co-CEO of Concerts West with Meglen. He described his extensive background in the business. Meglen said he went to Veterinarian school initially. "I feel like I work with animals some times," he joked. (ABC7)
Bina talked about rivalry between AEG Live and Live Nation. Meglen said he doesn't think being the number 1 is necessarily a good thing. He explained it is the difference between quality and quantity. (ABC7)
When they created Concerts West, Meglen said their first tour was Andrea Bocelli. They promoted first tour of Mariah Carey. (ABC7)
Meglen worked with MJ prior to "This Is It" once. He was a consultant to a firm in Japan that promoted two MJ shows in 1986 around Christmas.Meglen watched both shows and said it was great. Marcel Avram was the promoter. They both sold half house, he said, which is half of the tickets available. Meglen said they hid he empty seats so it wouldn't show. Bina asked if Wikipedia was wrong in saying the shows were sold out. "I don't use Wikipedia as source for my business," Meglen said. (ABC7)
Meglen said he next met MJ in 2007 with Peter Lopez, MJ's attorney at the time at the Wynn Hotel in Las Vegas. The meeting was to let MJ know what AEG was about, Meglen said. Gongaware, Raymone Bain (MJ's manager), Lopez, MJ were present. MJ recognized Gongaware, Meglen said. He came out of the bedroom, "Whenever I see Paul Gongaware I know everything is going to be all right".Meglen said MJ asked Gongaware about Brigitte, his girlfriend at the time. They wanted MJ to choose them for a comeback tour. "He was very excited," Meglen said. "He was great, full of energy, seem taller, firm handshake, he was there, he was very, very excited." (ABC7)
Meglen said almost immediately Gongaware took the lead on the MJ's This Is It project, since he had prior experience with MJ. Meglen said the expense of the show production falls under the artist to pay.
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Outside the presence of jury, Panish said Deborah Chang spoke with Grace Rwamba's lawyer and he doesn't' know where she is. Plaintiffs want to bring Rwamba to testify before they rest their case. They still need to finish Ortega's testimony too.
