JFK - Attentataufdeckung

delta.m schrieb:Klar, ich halte auch ein plötzliches, kurzes Erdbeben just zu diesem Zeitpunkt nicht für unwahrscheinlich.
Man kann sich vieles so hinbiegen ;)

Du weißt, dass JFks nicht in ein Laboratorium mit Robotern, A.I. und Laserpräzision eingeliefert wurde?

Du hast selbst noch nie einen Fehlgriff getan, bist nie gestolpert, ausgerutscht, hast nie daneben gegriffen?

delta.m schrieb:Das soll nun die Krawatte darstellen, so wie sie JFK beim Zeitpunkt des Treffers trug???

das musst du doch wissen. du glaubst an die single bullet.

FBI-Agent Robert Frazier, der die Krawatte im Labor hatte, sagte aus, dass der Kratzer auf der Vorderseite zu sehen war, wenn man die Krwatte selbst trüge auf der linken Seite

@monstra

monstra schrieb am 22.03.2018:Und wenn noch drei Friseure, Tankwarte oder Pudel gefunden werden, die mal mit dem Bruder eines CIA-Agenten einen Burger essen waren...

Ich frage mich wie ein ehemaliger Überläufer, also ein Verräter wie Oswald, dazu noch Kommunist von US-Militärs und antikommunisten so hofiert werden kann

Col. Lawrence Orlov – Was with deMohrenschildt when they first sought out Oswald and vistited him, RIF 104-10431-10034 Russ Holmes Work File / Marina and Orlov - Google Groups
Col. James “J.D.” Wilmeth – U.S. Army - Arlington Texas officer who visited Marina at Ruth Paine’s house a few days before the assassination, JFKCountercoup2: Col. J.D. Wilmeth Visits Marina / Col. J. D. Wilmeth - JFK Assassination Debate - The Education Forum

http://jfkcountercoup.blogspot.de/2015/02/colonels-at-dealey-plaza.html

The Dallas P.D. Intelligence Division maintained a paid informant who worked at Collins Radio and reported on fellow employees who appeared suspicious or subversive, including one who was reported to subscribe to the leftist I.F. Stone Weekly.

When Lee Harvey Oswald returned to Texas from Soviet Russia, George DeMohrenschildt introduced him to retired Navy Admiral Chester Bruton, an executive at Collins Radio, with the idea of Oswald getting a job there, as he had worked in a radio factory in Minsk, USSR. Oswald and Marina visited Bruton with DeMohrenschilt.

At the time of the assassination Adml. Bruton was working on a top-secret nuclear submarine communications project for Collins, with the Navy’s nuclear sub radar and communications HQ being based at Woods Hole, Massachusetts, close neighbors of Michael Paine’s family island.

http://jfkcountercoup.blogspot.de/2008/01/collins-radio-connections.html



siehe auch:

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=43&search=Mr_DeMohrenschildt+Oswald+admiral+Bruton#relPageId=261&tab=page




Es gibt noch einige andere Verbindungen zu Collins, die hier aufgelistet sind:

http://jfkcountercoup.blogspot.de/2008/01/collins-radio-connections.html

delta.m schrieb:Das soll nun die Krawatte darstellen, so wie sie JFK beim Zeitpunkt des Treffers trug???

Das FBI wusste wie die Krawatte im Originalzustand aussah

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/jfkinfo/jfk7/ce395.htm (Archiv-Version vom 29.10.2017)

@monstra

Hier noch eine weitere Verbindung zu den Diensten:

One of Oswald’s first acts upon arrival in Fort Worth in June 1962 was to go to the Texas Employment Commission and look for work, but he got more than a job from Virginia Hale and Anna Laurie Smith.

Virginia Hale got Oswald the sheet metal worker job at Leslie Welding, but while he was at the Texas Employment Commission Oswald asked if they knew of anyone who spoke the Russian language that he and his wife could meet.
In his article (Oswald’s Handlers) Bill Simpich writes: “Anna Laurie Smith said that she referred him to Peter Gregory, and ‘Mrs. Hall’ from the next desk, suggested Mrs. Max Clark and provided her name. This Mrs. Hall was Elena Hall, a Russian immigrant who was also part of the White Russian community …. Mrs. Elena Hall gave the names of Max and Gali Clark to Oswald at the Texas Employment Center and then went to work as a dental lab technician.”

The first person Oswald called was Gali Clark, an excellent Russian speaker, a former “Russian princess” who Simpich notes “made a point of shopping for the Oswald family and providing material support, bringing groceries to Marina at the Hall residence while Elena Hall recovered from a car accident.” In addition however, “Mrs. Hall took Marina and her baby in to live at her place during the first week of October, bought her some clothes and groceries, and had Marina’s teeth fixed with the financial help of George Bouhe….” And Elena Hall, who went from the Texas Employment Commission to work at the dental lab.

So besides getting Oswald a job, the one stop at the Texas Employment Commission got Marina and the baby a nice place to stay, and they had Marina’s teeth fixed and the Russian community bought them groceries and gave them financial help, especially George Bouhe.

But being employed as a laborer was not something Oswald enjoyed or wanted to do and he told Gali Clark’s husband Max Clark that he hated his work at Leslie Welding and wanted another line of work. Max Clark was an attorney and industrial security supervisor at General Dynamics who knew the FBI agent who later investigated him. Clark referred to his interviewing agent Earl Haley as “Earl”, and told the Warren Commission that he was familiar with Haley and the FBI from working with them at General Dynamics. Clark was an industrial security supervisor at the Convair wing of General Dynamics, who had the Air Force contract for the first funded ICBM study.
Max Clark also had a “covert security approval” by the CIA for “Project ROCK/IDIO/SGAPEX”.

According to DeMohrenschildt, Max Clark told him he checked with his friends in the FBI and that Oswald was okay. George DeMohrenschildt testified to the Warren Commission that during one of his conversation with his Dallas CIA contact J. Walton Moore, and Moore assured him that Oswald was a “harmless lunatic”.

https://jfkcountercoup.wordpress.com/2010/07/

@monstra

bredulino schrieb: In addition however, “Mrs. Hall took Marina and her baby in to live at her place during the first week of October, bought her some clothes and groceries, and had Marina’s teeth fixed with the financial help of George Bouhe….” And Elena Hall, who went from the Texas Employment Commission to work at the dental lab.

Mehr z udem unterstrichenen Aspekt:

Dr Albert Franklin Staples
"He said he recalled her teeth were in very poor condition. She had many cavities and needed much dental attention. He said he had no personal recollection of giving her a prescription on October 10, 1962, but felt sure that he would have given her a prescription on October 15, 1962 when she had three extractions. He said in such cases it is the usual practice for him to give a prescription of codeine or combination of codeine and aspirin to keep the patient comfortable after such work."[3]

Thanksgiving, 1962
The Oswald clan (minus Marguerite) held what was termed a family reunion at the home of Robert Oswald on Thanksgiving. This was only a few weeks after Marina's dental work. John Pic drove his own car there from his home at Lackland AFB and wrote the mileage down in a notebook he kept for just that purpose. [4] This is usually done in order to claim such trips as work related expenses for tax purposes. Pic and Marina also used this notebook to record a conversation on medical matters, though possibly only remnants of this were kept in the Warren Commission volumes, designated Pic Exhibit 60. Given the possibility this trip was work-related, as well as Pic's background in Red hunting in conjunction with ONI and the FBI on Ellis Island, the discussion with Marina may well have been some type of debrief.

Project Hope
In 1960, Dr Albert Franklin Staples was part of the medical team of Project Hope in Ecuador and Columbia. [5] In 1964, some time after handing over Marina's dental records to the Warren Commission, Dr Staples travelled to West Africa to rejoin Project Hope. [6] The underlying purpose of Project Hope was in Cold War Psychological Operations which had CD Jackson pulling the strings. [7]

Percival Flack Brundage
Brundage was treasurer and director of Project Hope from 1959 to 1962. [8] During this same period, he was setting up a CIA proprietary to support Cuban operations through JMWave. Brundage had also been President of the Friends of Albert Schweitzer College between 1953 and 1958. This was the Swiss college that Oswald applied to attend while making plans to go to the Soviet Union. A Unitarian, Brundage was also keen folk dancer, and may have attended the same folk dance festivals as Mike and Ruth Paine.



Mehr zu "Project Hope"
https://etd.ohiolink.edu/rws_etd/document/get/ohiou1198092879/inline

Mehr zu Percival Flack Brundage


https://jfkcountercoup.wordpress.com/2011/07/07/699/
https://books.google.de/books?id=rdw9DwAAQBAJ&pg=PA340&lpg=PA340&dq=Percival+Flack+Brundage+cia&source=bl&ots=UoD7lp9aKm&sig=lJtvg7pwEqRFguqjK_QaZ8y1m-0&hl=de&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj3lKCm9a3aAhVGJ1AKHfP1CcgQ6AEIVzAL#v=onepage&q&f=false

@monstra


Zusammenfassung:

monstra schrieb am 22.03.2018:Das Versagen der US-Nachrichtendienste liegt darin, eine Gestalt wie Oswald nicht spätestens nach seiner Rückkehr aus der Sowjetunion unter strenge Beobachtung genommen zu haben

Das ist nachweislich falsch. Sowohl CIA als auch FBI hattenOoswald nach seiner Rückkehr auf dem Schirm. CIA, FBI und militärische Dienste wie der ONI hatten Akten zu Oswald.

monstra schrieb am 22.03.2018:Kurz und gut: Solche Kennverhältnisse sind kein Zufall, sagen aber auch nichts aus.

Oswald war von einem engmaschigen Netz von Geheimdienstmitarbeitern umgeben. Dieses vermittelte LHO Jobs, bot Obdach sowie medizinische Versorgung.

Wir haben auch aussagen wie die des CIA-Mitarbeiters Wilcott, dass OSwald tatsächlich für einen Geheimdienst arbeitete. Dies würde auch erklären, warum LHO trotz seines zur Schau gestellten marxistischen Profils Unterstützung und Jobmöglichkeiten bei Personen, Firmen und Organisationen bekam, für die er als Überläufer und Marxist eigentlich ein Sicherheitsrisiko dargestellt hätte.

OpLibelle schrieb am 24.03.2018:Hat jemand von Euch einen Link zu dem fraglichen FBI-Bericht?

Angenommen, die Geschichte ist kein Fake (sie ist es wohl nicht), welche Erklärung habt i
Ihr dafür?

ich habe kürzlich etwas anderes entdeckt;

After skipping out on the Leslie Welding job without notice, Oswald was still owed two pay checks for the last days he had worked, and the frugal Oswald wanted the money but didn’t want to have to go back to pick it up in person

...

When Oswald endorsed his last two checks from Louv-R-Pac, he used the address of Gary Taylor. Although he never stayed there, Taylor had given Oswald permission to use his address and he did so on his Post Office box application and at Jaggers/Chiles/Stoval, his next job.

According to A. J. Weberman: Some of the signatures on the back of the Louv-R-Pac paychecks were not OSWALD’S. The FBI Laboratory examined the endorsements and compared them against the signature on OSWALD’S passport. They did not match, although Oswald had used his passport as identification to cash these checks, and his passport number was written on each one. The FBI stated: “Under date of December 5, 1963, the FBI Laboratory advised that the handprinting and handwriting of LEE HARVEY OSWALD, available in Bureau files, have been searched (Deleted) without effecting an identification.”…The HSCA examined 63 specimens of OSWALD’S signature, but none of the signatures on the Louv-R-Pac paychecks, although their existence had been brought to the attention of the HSCA by this researcher. The HSCA chose instead to examine: “A letter dated July 13, 1962, to Leslie Welding Co. signed LEE H. OSWALD; written on part of the page from a yellow legal pad. Blue ink. Ball point pen. Location: Archives.” [HSCA V8 p230]

https://jfkcountercoup.wordpress.com/2010/07/



Weiß da jemand mehr?

@monstra

Max Clark hat Verbindungen zu einer Gruppe, die anscheinend eine Intrige gegen JFk sponn:

Max Clark’s file states that he “worked closely” with I. B. Hale, a former FBI agent who was the chief of industrial security at General Dynamics. I. B. Hale had been married to Virginia Hale, who got Oswald his sheet metal worker job at Leslie Whiting during July 1962. When interviewed after the assassination, Virginia Hale said that she remembered Oswald “quite well”.

The Hale family was involved with blackmailing the Kennedy Administration in the TFX scandal

During this time, the Hale family was involved in a brazen campaign of extortion designed to force the Kennedy Administration into approving General Dynamics as the prime contractor to build the TFX bomber at their Fort Worth plant. This plane is now better known as the F-111. At the time, this 7 billion dollar contract was the largest military contract in history.

Two weeks after I.B.’s wife Virginia got Oswald a job, their sons led a break-in at Judith Campbell’s house. Campbell was the girlfriend of not only John F. Kennedy, but also Mafia chieftains Sam Giancana and Johnny Roselli.

...

Knowing of these relationships, the Hoover FBI had created a stake-out across the street from Campbell’s home. While Special Agent William Carter was on duty, he saw two young men in their 20s come to Campbell’s apartment. Campbell was not home, and the FBI later verified that she was elsewhere. One of the perpetrators went inside the apartment, while the other one stood as lookout on the balcony. Agent Carter obtained the license plate numbers for the car, which matched Hale’s car.

The FBI agent concluded that the perpetrators were Hale’s sons based on their age (early 20s) and their physical description. The perpetrators left after about 15 minutes without taking anything. It is reasonable to assume that they had planted a listening bug.

The reason for the stakeout is right in the FBI report: The FBI had heard the stories that Judith Campbell was the girlfriend of Sam Giancana, Johnny Roselli, and JFK. The FBI wanted no part of this case and declined to take any further action after running out a few leads.

Attempted blackmail around the TFX contract would appear to be the motive. Two months later, in October 1962, General Dynamics won the 7 billion dollar contract over the heavily favored Boeing. This controversial decision dogged the Kennedy Administration from that day.

http://aarclibrary.org/the-jfk-case-the-twelve-who-built-the-oswald-legend-part-6-white-russians-keep-an-eye-on-oswald-in-dallas/


Der TFX-Skandal würde im Jahr 1963 höchste Regierungsmitarbeiter in Bedrängnis bringen:

McNamara
http://www.spiegel.de/spiegel/print/d-45142972.html


Lyndon Johnson
http://www.gmunari.com/2016/12/28/lbj-the-tfx-scandal/

Fred Korth Scheidungsanwalt von LHos Stiefvater und Marneminister von 1961 bis wenige Wochen vor dem Attentat in Dallas
Wikipedia: Fred Korth

Africanus schrieb am 08.04.2018:Was aber nicht bedeutet, dass Oswald im Erdgeschoss war, während die Schüsse abgegeben wurden. Oswald wird durch diese Aussagen überhaupt nicht entlastet.

Da um 12:15 Uhr der Schütze von Zeugen am Fenster des offiziellen sniper´s nest gesehen wurde und Zeugen über Oswalds Anwesenheit im Erdgeschoss noch um 12:20, 12:25 Uhr berichteten entlastet dies Oswald.

https://richardcharnin.wordpress.com/2015/05/24/jfk-evidence-oswald-was-on-the-1st-floor-minutes-before-the-shooting/

bredulino schrieb:Zeugen über Oswalds Anwesenheit im Erdgeschoss noch um 12:20, 12:25 Uhr berichteten entlastet dies Oswald.

Dumm nur, dass LHO von 12:25 bis 12:32 anscheinend kein Alibi hat. Da hätte ich an seiner Stelle unbedingt darauf geachtet ;)


btw.
waren die Uhren der "Zeit-Zeugen" alle funkgenau synchronisiert?
+/- 1 Minute macht da schon viel aus.

delta.m schrieb:Dumm nur, dass LHO von 12:25 bis 12:32 anscheinend kein Alibi hat. Da hätte ich an seiner Stelle unbedingt darauf geachtet ;)

Wurde sein Alibi aufgezeichnet, mitstenografiert?

Warum bist du nur so vergesslich?

http://22november1963.org.uk/lee-harvey-oswald-alibi (Archiv-Version vom 10.04.2018)

delta.m schrieb:btw.
waren die Uhren der "Zeit-Zeugen" alle funkgenau synchronisiert?
+/- 1 Minute macht da schon viel aus.

Man konnte sich an der Zeitanzeige des TSBD orientieren:




Wieso mussten die Zeugen funkgenau synchronisert sein? Wenn Oswald laut offizieller Version um 11.55 Uhr schon im fünften Stock gewesen sein und Zeugen ihn noch um 12:20 Uhr, 12:25 Uhr im erdgeschoss sahen...

bredulino schrieb:Man konnte sich an der Zeitanzeige des TSBD orientieren:

Die vom Inneren des TSPD nur schwer einsehbar war. Und ob die Uhren im Inneren mit dieser Uhr synchronisiert war, wissen wir auch nicht. Und ob die mechanischen Armbanduhren wieder mit den stationären Zeitanzeigen synchron waren, ist sogar schon ziemlich zweifelhaft.

Zudem werden die meisten Zeugen nicht bei einer Begegnung mit Oswald postwendend auf ihre oder eine Uhr gesehen haben, sondern die Zeit rekonstruiert haben.

Ergo sind die Zeugenaussagen und die Schussabgabe durch Oswald um 12.30 Uhr nicht unvereinbar. Umgekehrt gibt es keinen Zeugen, der Oswald ein zweifelsfreies Alibi geben könnte.

Hatten wir vor gefühlt 300 Seiten schon einmal, diesen Punkt. @bredulino ist da zuverlässig wie die Uhr auf dem Dach des TSBD: Ein Stichwort, und schon kommt Argument Nr. 87b zum Zuge.

Das ist so langweilig, dass ich mich nur noch höchst selten hier zu Wort melde.

bredulino schrieb:Wieso mussten die Zeugen funkgenau synchronisert sein? Wenn Oswald laut offizieller Version um 11.55 Uhr schon im fünften Stock gewesen sein und Zeugen ihn noch um 12:20 Uhr, 12:25 Uhr im erdgeschoss sahen...

Er kann ja ab 11:55 oben gewesen sein und alles für sein Vorhaben hergerichtet haben.
Um 12:20 ist er dann runter,
hat sich für 5 Minuten blicken lassen und ist dann wieder hoch.

Aber garantiert habe ich wieder was vergessen ... ;)

delta.m schrieb:Aber garantiert habe ich wieder was vergessen ... ;)

du scheinst zu trollen. Du liest keine links. Was soll das?
http://22november1963.org.uk/who-saw-oswald-in-the-sixth-floor-window

bredulino schrieb:Du liest keine links.

Doch, ganz oben steht:

Summary

Oswald seems to have claimed to have been on the first floor of the Texas School Book Depository. Two colleagues, James Jarman and Harold Norman, place him there no more than seven minutes before the shooting.

=

Zusammenfassung

Oswald scheint behauptet zu haben, im ersten Stock des Texas School Book Depository gewesen zu sein. Zwei Kollegen, James Jarman und Harold Norman, platzieren ihn dort nicht mehr als sieben Minuten vor dem Schießen.

Bis sieben Minuten vor dem Schießen war er im 1. Stock.

Verstehe ich das richtig?

delta.m schrieb:Doch, ganz oben steht:

ich meine KOMPLETT lesen- nicht nur die ersten zwei Sätze.

delta.m schrieb:Bis sieben Minuten vor dem Schießen war er im 1. Stock.

Verstehe ich das richtig?

Nein

bredulino schrieb:ich meine KOMPLETT lesen- nicht nur die ersten zwei Sätze.

Dann ist die Zusammenfassung falsch, oder was?

delta.m schrieb:Dann ist die Zusammenfassung falsch, oder was?

wenn du die darauffolgenden Sätze liest wirst du die Antwort schon finden

bredulino schrieb:wenn du die darauffolgenden Sätze liest wirst du die Antwort schon finden

Ich hab schon einige Versionen gelesen.
Welche von den verschiedenen Alibi-Versionen ist denn nun die am "meisten richtige"?
Welche gefällt denn Dir am besten?